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Is what we see is the outcome, I think CBT falls short of the need for this and maybe dynamic does as well.
我们看到的是结果我认为CBT无法满足这个要求动态疗法可能也做不到
It's not so much based on early childhood experience but the relationship is key,
它不是很大程度上建立在早期童年经历上其中关系是关键
the relationship is where the safety begins to emerge, as maybe was illustrated in that story
安全感就是从这种关系中出现的可能那个故事也能说明这一点
where I went to the guy's wedding and then he could talk about it
我去了他的婚礼然后他可以谈论折磨
because of what was happening between us, um, again that wasn't my plan but you learn as you go.
因为我们之间所发生了这些事情我再强调，这并不是我的计划，但是你们可以从中学习
Thank you. Yeah. Martha. I wanted to ask you about the role of anger in the therapy.
谢谢你，不用谢。玛莎。我想请教你愤怒在治疗中的作用
I mean one might think that um the antidote an antidote to the shame and humiliation and the destruction of the personality
有人认为愤怒是解药可以对抗羞愧感和耻辱感要摧毁人格可以
would be to get the person to be angry at the people who did it to them and say this just wasn't right,
让人们憎恨那些对他们施暴的人说这么做不是对的
I have a right to be treated with dignity and so on
我有权得到有尊严的对待，等等
and also for you as therapist the anger might prevent who did it to them and say this just wasn't right,
对于你来说，治疗师，愤怒可能阻止某种抑郁感和分崩离析感的产生
setting in. I just wondered what you think about that?
我想了解你的看法?
Yeah the anger, often I find is greater on our side as the therapist.
是的，我常常发现我们作为治疗师，反而愤怒感更强烈
It's like other trauma, um, when a woman is raped or when a child is abused,
这像是另一种创伤当一个妇女被强奸，儿童被虐待
they find their first stance often is to blame themselves for it
他们的第一个反应就是责备自己
and they don't reach a point of anger er even when a woman has been raped
他们不会到达愤怒的程度甚至是一个遭到强奸的女性
she can say somehow I feel dirty, er, somehow I shouldn't have put myself in this situation,
她会说，我觉得自己很脏我不能再想象那个场景
somehow it was my fault and sometimes society colludes with that too.
这是我的错有时候社会和施虐者串通一气
The same thing with victims of torture.
折磨的受害者也是这样
They blame themselves for it, that I shouldn't have done it this way, or I shouldn't have done it that way.
他们责怪自己我不应该这么做我不应该那么做
