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Todd: Talking about kids and school, what do you think about failure? Like it seems like we're moving to where we're not allowed to tell kids that they're not doing well, that everybody has to be a winner. You know, everybody gets a good grade. What do you think about that especially as a teacher and a parent?
托德：就孩子和学校来说，你怎么看待失败？我们不能告诉孩子他们做得不好，或是每个人都一定要成功。或是所有人都要拿好成绩之类的。作为老师和家长来说，你怎么看？
Julia: As a teacher, I think, I read something recently that the chastising a student, telling them they did bad, has no motivational value whatsoever but praise does. So definitely I think it's important to always praise. If you have a really bad student and you can't find anything to praise them on then I don't know what the answer is really. But I'm sure you can always find something to praise someone on.
朱莉娅：作为老师来说，我最近看了一些文章，里面说处罚学生或是告诉学生他们做得不好并不会起到激励作用，而表扬可以鼓励学生。所以我认为表扬非常重要。如果你的班级里有一个坏学生，你在他身上找不到可以表扬的地方，那我也不知道应该怎么办了。可是我确定一个学生是会有值得表扬的地方的。
Todd: Yeah.
托德：好。
Julia: So I think it's important to focus on the positives all the time.
朱莉娅：我认为一直关注积极的方面很重要。
Todd: See actually I kind of disagree.
托德：其实我不太同意你的观点。
Julia: Do you?
朱莉娅：是吗？
Todd: Yeah. I think that, you know, that your score is or your progress is absolute. Like either you pass or you fail, either you get high marks or low marks but that's the motivation. Like if you get, if you don't do well, then you want to try harder. You know, like if you're a fat kid and you don't want to be fat then you, you know, you're motivated to lose weight or if you aren't a star in the baseball team you need to practice harder so you move up. But if you tell kids that they're doing great when actually they're not exceptional then maybe that actually does harm.
托德：对。我认为成绩或者是进步是绝对的。不是合格就是不合格，不是高分就是低分，但我认为这就是动力。如果你成绩不好，那你就会想再努力一些。就好像如果你是个胖孩子，你不想再胖下去，你就会有动力去减肥，或是如果你不是棒球队里的明星球员，那你就需要在练习时更加努力，这样你才能进步。但是如果你告诉并不优秀的学生他们做得很好，这可能会造成伤害。
Julia: OK, well maybe I misexplained that. I don't mean give a false, I don't mean say they're doing well when they're not doing well but what I mean is focus more on the successes than the failures.
朱莉娅：好，也许我没有解释清楚。我的意思不是给出错误的认可，我不是说在学生做得不好时还要夸他们做得好，我的意思是要更多地关注成功而不是失败。
Todd: Oh, I see. Like confidence building?
托德：哦，我明白了。建立信心，对吧？
Julia: Yeah, I guess that's what I mean more. But I guess we're talking about motivation rather than an end result like, of course, yeah, you're going to fail some things. I don't know. I never failed that many things at school and later on in life when I did encounter failure, I took it pretty bad so perhaps it would have been healthier for me to have failed a few things. I don't know.
朱莉娅：对，对，那才是我的意思。我认为我们现在在说的是动力而不是结果，当然人肯定会遇到失败。要怎么说……如果我在学校和生活中从来没有经历过失败，那当我日后失败时我可能会无法接受，所以经历过失败对我来说可能更有好处。不知道我说明白没有。
Todd: Well that's the question, isn't it? Like when you fail or you do bad I think that maybe that's the eye-opening moment you need to see. Like you need to see the truth rather than just tell somebody that they're doing well when actually maybe they're not or that they're exceptional and talented when maybe they're not.
托德：这是个问题，不是吗？如果你失败了或是表现不好，我想要用开放的观点去看。要看到事实，而不是在学生做得不好或者没有那种天赋时还要告诉他们做得很好。
Julia: When they're not, that's true. Yeah, there was another thing that I read as well about telling, praising children for their intellgence, you should never, you should never tell a child they're smart because they get a false image of what intelligence is. You should always praise effort.
朱莉娅：没错。我还看了一篇有关表扬孩子智商的文章，那篇文章的观点是永远不要告诉孩子他们很聪明，因为那会让他们对智商产生假象。你应该要表扬他们的努力。
Todd: Ah, right.
托德：说得对。
Julia: As opposed to some sort of innate, what we believe to be an innate quality that you can never have if you don't have it. So telling a child yeah you're really smart, when the child faces a problem that requires them to apply themselves and maybe fail they're afraid.
朱莉娅：而不是强调那种天生的品质，我们认为天生的品质是，如果你不拥有那种品质，那你就永远不会拥有。如果你告诉孩子你非常聪明，在孩子面临需要他们自己去解决的问题时，他们可能会害怕失败。
Todd: Mmm.
托德：嗯。
Julia: Because then they may think no I'm not intelligent after all. So it should always be about praising effort and actually the result is not so important.
朱莉娅：因为他们可能会想，也许我并不聪明。所以应该表扬孩子们的努力，而结果并不是那么重要。
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